Just make sure you give the steak fair warning before slicing into it... so it's lawyer can't claim ignorance of the danger later....
...ahh, it still doesn't look quite right...
- Thread starter The Tourist
- Start date
Just make sure you give the steak fair warning before slicing into it... so it's lawyer can't claim ignorance of the danger later....
The Tourist
Banned
Well, it would be kind of unusual for a gendarme to look past the various real weapons I might have to cob my steak knife. Perhaps in Mayberry.
But that's the purpose of the thread. I want a knife for dining that appears for all intents to be a top-shelf steak knife.
I also intend to have one of those tupperware sleeves to transport the knife home and keep additional amounts of gravy out of my clothes, albeit, most of the former amounts are on the outside...
I tried to find a picture of thse for you, but alas no luck.
MikeStewart
New member
MikeStewart
New member
Forgot to add--Most of them--regardless of maker--usually fit right into those Tupperware Knife carriers.
Mike
Mike
GotGarlic
New member
It's the same one I give DH when he says "Okay, I guess the Subway at Wal-Mart is out ... "
Yeah, he's learned. 
The Tourist
Banned
My aunt Clara had an old adage about that. It doesn't translate smoothly from Sicilian, but loosely, "Sex will get you through time of no hot-dogs better than hot-dogs will get you through times of no sex."
Wise woman, that Clara...
S.Shepherd
New member
Folks,
The issues you are raising are exactly why it's best to carry a knife that is obviously a bit of a beauty.
It is far less likely to be mistaken for a Weapon.
On the Sporting Side of the Industry we run into this all the time and a nice looking knife that exudes quality and borders on art work is the way to go.
You end up with a law enforcement officer asking to see it to admire it rather than confiscate it.
I would never carry a fixed blade knife into a restaurant to cut meat.
I carry a very nice $350.00 custom made folder that is razor sharp and is not noticeable--even in discreet use.
I find it more convenient.
I was just Razzin' Chico for having an ugly Knife.
Life is too short to have an ugly knife.
Mike.......................
Mike...I really hope you are joking
Law enforcement doesn't care whaT a knife looks like, only how long the blade is. No state law has a provision that says, "a knife with a blade longer than allowed by law is ok, as long as it's pretty"
MikeStewart
New member
Actually I was not Kidding.
If You check--Including Michigan--there is no stated length of blade for Carrying a knife.
Most of those misconceptions are just fostered by lack of knowledge of the actual laws.
Most state laws that pertain to knives rely on Intent.
If you are stopped with a wicked looking black death tactical folder or fixed blade knife you are far more likely to be detained or looked at with suspicion than if you are carrying a very well made high quality knife.
That is a fact--if is not a Guess on my part.
I have testified is Local--State and even Federal Courts - as well as U.S. Customs and Congressional hearings as an expert witness in cases involving knives. I have testified for both the prosecution and defense on different occasions so I just might know what I'm talking about.
Some one Above mentioned the California Statues be oppressive.
They are referring to 120-20 of the California penal Code that pertains to the Definition of a Weapon.
Did You know that a Pencil in Your jacket Pocket under that section of the law becomes a Dagger as soon as you show "INTENT" to use it as such ?
Nice folks that carry a knife in their pocket for genuine utility use or to cut steaks in a restaurants are pretty safe from laws that are written to use in criminal situations.
I rarely Kid about the law.
I know it pretty well.
Mike
If You check--Including Michigan--there is no stated length of blade for Carrying a knife.
Most of those misconceptions are just fostered by lack of knowledge of the actual laws.
Most state laws that pertain to knives rely on Intent.
If you are stopped with a wicked looking black death tactical folder or fixed blade knife you are far more likely to be detained or looked at with suspicion than if you are carrying a very well made high quality knife.
That is a fact--if is not a Guess on my part.
I have testified is Local--State and even Federal Courts - as well as U.S. Customs and Congressional hearings as an expert witness in cases involving knives. I have testified for both the prosecution and defense on different occasions so I just might know what I'm talking about.
Some one Above mentioned the California Statues be oppressive.
They are referring to 120-20 of the California penal Code that pertains to the Definition of a Weapon.
Did You know that a Pencil in Your jacket Pocket under that section of the law becomes a Dagger as soon as you show "INTENT" to use it as such ?
Nice folks that carry a knife in their pocket for genuine utility use or to cut steaks in a restaurants are pretty safe from laws that are written to use in criminal situations.
I rarely Kid about the law.
I know it pretty well.
Mike
AllenOK
New member
Chico, I would have to agree, that yes, the knife you pictured looks a little "chunky".
I honestly couldn't recommend a knife for what you want.
I do have one little story, though. I had gone out to eat at Don Pablos once, years ago. I was served a dinner that always had a big steak knife presented along with the plate (think the knife at Outback, same kind). Unfortunately, the waitress had neglected to give me my silverware yet. I looked around at some empty tables, and there wasn't any rolled silverware on them.
I looked around again, looking at folks. One couple was looking at me, realizing what I was looking for, but at a loss as to how they could help. I looked at them, shrugged, and said, "Oh well, good thing I come prepared", and promptly pulled out my lockblade that I carried in a sheath on my belt. I had it lubed up to the point I could pull it and open it in one smooth, fluid motion, in just a fraction of a second (no springs, gravity assist, etc.). I promptly used to clunker given to me with my food as an impromtu one-tine fork, and my knife to cut the food with. The couple looking at me chuckled. A few minutes later, the waitress came by, realized what was going on, and immediately ran to get me some silverware. I thanked her, cleaned my knife, and put it away.
The only sad thing is, that particular knife broke on my last year. And, I shouldn't have been carrying it, much less using it, as it was a collector's item of sorts, and as far as I know, it's no longer made.
C'est la Vie!
I'm now in search of a good replacement. Finding one is hard, as most places are still out-of-stock in pocket knives from the Christmas fiasco, and no idea when they are getting more.
I honestly couldn't recommend a knife for what you want.
I do have one little story, though. I had gone out to eat at Don Pablos once, years ago. I was served a dinner that always had a big steak knife presented along with the plate (think the knife at Outback, same kind). Unfortunately, the waitress had neglected to give me my silverware yet. I looked around at some empty tables, and there wasn't any rolled silverware on them.
I looked around again, looking at folks. One couple was looking at me, realizing what I was looking for, but at a loss as to how they could help. I looked at them, shrugged, and said, "Oh well, good thing I come prepared", and promptly pulled out my lockblade that I carried in a sheath on my belt. I had it lubed up to the point I could pull it and open it in one smooth, fluid motion, in just a fraction of a second (no springs, gravity assist, etc.). I promptly used to clunker given to me with my food as an impromtu one-tine fork, and my knife to cut the food with. The couple looking at me chuckled. A few minutes later, the waitress came by, realized what was going on, and immediately ran to get me some silverware. I thanked her, cleaned my knife, and put it away.
The only sad thing is, that particular knife broke on my last year. And, I shouldn't have been carrying it, much less using it, as it was a collector's item of sorts, and as far as I know, it's no longer made.
C'est la Vie!
I'm now in search of a good replacement. Finding one is hard, as most places are still out-of-stock in pocket knives from the Christmas fiasco, and no idea when they are getting more.
The Tourist
Banned
I'm going to use the chunky knife. It works. What's another CCW arrest in the big scheme of things. And the knife is very sharp.
Lots of corrosion resistant chrome, and remember I like salt and gravy.
Lots of corrosion resistant chrome, and remember I like salt and gravy.
The Tourist
Banned
Usually, so am I. Got my nose broken twice in that pursuit.
But like I said, I'd like to show my wife that I can eat in public without jamming a stiletto into the table.
But this knife has a wooden handle that appears to be fastened with three flattened metal rivets. It might look a tad bigger, but it is Chicago Cutlery-ish...
gadzooks
Member
Just so you know, TT, I think you've got a good lookin' knife. More of a regular carry piece than what I use at table, but better lookin' than what I keep in my pocket (CRKT 5600), and I've used it at table in places like L'Auberge and the Ranch House. If anybody commented, they did so quietly...I didn't hear 'em.
Rob Babcock
New member
How about an Opinel? I don't recall exactly what steel they use but I imagine you could put a very serviceable edge on one compared to a house steak knife, and nothing looks much more innocuous than an Opinel! Besides, they're cheap so if you mess it up and let it rust it won't be the end of the world.
My next pick would be a laminated Mora, the one with the red handle. 60 hRc, takes a very good edge; also cheap and non-threatening looking.
My next pick would be a laminated Mora, the one with the red handle. 60 hRc, takes a very good edge; also cheap and non-threatening looking.
The Tourist
Banned
I think it looks nice, as well. I like the looks of things that are durable in the spirit of "form follows function."
Truth be told, I think the original designer of this knife made it quite useful for a good number of chores in like. Let's face it, old 1830s mountain men usually carried a Green River knife, and used it for everything.
Easily, I could do backpacking with it.
Edit: I wish I could take a better picture to show how bright that bevel polished. It's very sharp for the first time over the stones.
Truth be told, I think the original designer of this knife made it quite useful for a good number of chores in like. Let's face it, old 1830s mountain men usually carried a Green River knife, and used it for everything.
Easily, I could do backpacking with it.
Edit: I wish I could take a better picture to show how bright that bevel polished. It's very sharp for the first time over the stones.
gadzooks
Member
Opinels are fun, but when they get wet, the wood swells, either open or closed, and makes 'em a pain in the butt. On a related note, I modified an old Opinel lock ring so I could lock the knife closed as well as opened. Here in SoCal, the weather gets really dry in summer, and the knife gets loose enough to open in pocket. I sent a letter with pictures to Opinel, and some months later they sent me a knife that was factory-modified as per. It's a regular feature on them now. If this is going to be a "dining out steak cutter," you could always pick up a nice little bento. They generally come with a nice wooden sheath on 'em, and can be sharpened very nicely. Hardly a weapon, but a nice little cow cutter.
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S.Shepherd
New member
Michigan -750.226... Carrying with unlawful intent
Any person who, with intent to use the same unlawfully
against the person of another, goes armed with a pistol
or other firearm or dagger, dirk, razor, stiletto, or
knife having a blade over 3 inches in length, or any
other dangerous or deadly weapon or instrument, shall
be guilty of a felony, punishable by imprisonment in
the state prison for not more than 5 years or by a fine
of not more than 2,500 dollars.
- 750.227. (1) A person shall not carry a dagger, dirk,
stiletto, a double-edged nonfolding stabbing instrument of
any length, or any dangerous weapon, except a hunting
knife adapted and carried as such, concealed on or about
his or her person, or whether concealed or otherwise in
any vehicle... except in his or her dwelling house [or]
place of business... (3) A person who violates this
section is guilty of a felony...
thats michigan law..period.
Congradulations on your testimony, but your missing the point.
Initial contact with law enforcement will leave you charged if they investigate a complaint that there's a "person with a weapon", and you are found in violation of the law.
While you can go out, and hire a lawyer. and spend time and alot of money proving your innocence in court it a hell of alot easier just to follow the letter of the law.
Ask most police, and this is exactly what their going to tell you. Add the context of this discussion..you have "Mr.Biker" carrying a large knife and it simply doesn't add up to a happy ending.
Law enforcement simply don't have the "officer discretion" that the did 20 years ago.
BTW, I know the law pretty well also..
"If You check--Including Michigan--there is no stated length of blade for Carrying a knife.
Most of those misconceptions are just fostered by lack of knowledge of the actual laws"
I suggest you read it, before calling someone else ignorant.
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The Tourist
Banned
There is no doubt in my mind that you do. This is just a little 'mind game' that Stewart likes to pull. And frankly, it's my opinion he sometimes makes history up "on the fly."
You see, if the 'Maestro' can't be the alpha-dog then we have to put up with long winded speeches like this. I have kept some rambling e-mails he sent me a +one year ago that defy logic.
Do what I do. Do nothing.
Sooner or later we'll get a treatise on convex edges. His problem is that we have many knife professionals here who will correct his mistakes. Just remember that when the master falls one of his sycophants shows up.
One of the first things we all learned when we joined this forum is that everyone tries to keep it clean. No bashing other forums, no bashing other people.
Buzz
Buzz
The Tourist
Banned
Oh, I agree. It's just that I've been down this road before.
Remember, Buzz, I have stated several times that if I am left alone I am the life of the party. I like it here, I smell an ambush.
You'll get no problem with me if no one else starts a problem. You have my word on that.
S.Shepherd
New member
buzz, I have no problem, other that I don't like being called ignorant--by an obviously ignorant person.
Other than what I know from expierience, a 5second google search comes up with the law. People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
The Tourist
Banned
Getting back to the important stuff--that being beautiful women, huge motorcycles and premium steel--there's another element here.
My size.
I'm not the skinny little rag-doll of my former youth. This same knife that PieSusan might brandish would look like a double-hilt claymore. On me, this knife probably looks like a pathetic butterknife.
Remember that no less than Harley Moco itself had to kill another cow to make my leather jacket. They show outdoor movies across my back.
And to be sure, the only one we have to please is my wife. If I put a mirror-finished v-grind on any implement, we're good to go.
Now granted, that's heresy to Sam, JoeC and Buzz. But think of this as a "dining implement," not fine cutlery. I might have to touch it up after every serious meal.
(Epilogue: I talked to Locutus the other day, and he is involved in the same project. He reports that he took a knife to dinner and was very careful that his slices avoided touching the plate. I'm not going to do that. It's a knife, not The Hope Diamond.)
My size.
I'm not the skinny little rag-doll of my former youth. This same knife that PieSusan might brandish would look like a double-hilt claymore. On me, this knife probably looks like a pathetic butterknife.
Remember that no less than Harley Moco itself had to kill another cow to make my leather jacket. They show outdoor movies across my back.
And to be sure, the only one we have to please is my wife. If I put a mirror-finished v-grind on any implement, we're good to go.
Now granted, that's heresy to Sam, JoeC and Buzz. But think of this as a "dining implement," not fine cutlery. I might have to touch it up after every serious meal.
(Epilogue: I talked to Locutus the other day, and he is involved in the same project. He reports that he took a knife to dinner and was very careful that his slices avoided touching the plate. I'm not going to do that. It's a knife, not The Hope Diamond.)
I always was taught that a kitchen knife needed to match the needs and hand of the person using it. After one decides what is a proper knife (made to last from the best materials you can afford for the stated needed purpose), isn't the rest pretty subjective?
My best friend, Andy carried a big knife wherever he went and he was never bothered even when taking it out in a restaurant or coffeeshop. I know, because I was with him when he did so.
My best friend, Andy carried a big knife wherever he went and he was never bothered even when taking it out in a restaurant or coffeeshop. I know, because I was with him when he did so.
The Tourist
Banned
Well, that would be this knife, to a "T."
I'm a great fan of "high carbon, low chromium" alloys. Most of my serious (and yikes-priced EDCs) are in that range. I'm trying to grow out of that snobby opinion. However, a nice Graham SS3 sure slices anything.
I also am turning to "real world" knives. Not to drift too far, but provide an analogy, I wouldn't take any of these knives to Sturgis. I do get a Chinese Shrade Old Timer from a distributer, and it looks like a Buck 110, all for 6.99 yankee. It takes a keen polished edge.
I'd take two or three of them on the road to South Dakota. I could dull them with impunity, break them, trade them for gasoline--and then forget I ever bought one in getting home.
Same deal here. I don't want to worry about my edges when I go out with my wife. Heck, we have precious little "alone" time as it is. If the knife hits the plate, rolls the edge, falls to the floor, cracks its handle or gets sold to the diner next to me, no biggee, no loss.
It's a tool for a fool. And dining with my wife I want to be an attentive husband, not a self-absorbed tinker.
The Tourist
Banned
As this thread is now many pages, I don't want to appear as talking down to anyone. This has been a fun project for me, and I hope the discussion has been fun for everyone.
Now, I'm sure there are many of you who shrug and point out, "Hey, a knife's a knife. Pick out a pretty one." And that's a valid criticism.
Perhaps "the knife guys" get too picky over details, and we should broaden the scope here.
First off, going all of the way back to Edo, there is nothing, nothing, like a polished V-grind edge, or more properly a "Hira-niku-sukunai." And if you've ever cut yourself with a razor, and never felt it, the circumstance needs no further explanation.
When you "take the curse" as JoeC and Buzz can verify, nothing is sharp enough, and we darn near bankrupt the house searching out new toys and sharpening tools on a fool's errand.
I don't like to "saw" through food. In fact, I once took a Japanese laminate knife to a Madison's Ginza of Tokyo for the chef performing "grilling in the round" for our meal. Knives should slice. The chef thought so, I almost didn't get my knife back...
However, not many of us carry a 2,200 dollar Hattori gyuto around in our jeans, or need to. We just need a nice knife. And that's the rub.
Many of the fine knives look out of place, and the ones that look mundane take a lousy edge. And truth be told, I don't want a high maintenance knife for this project. I want something to toss into the sink when I get home.
And until I can save a few nickels for a custom SShepard knife built to take a ham-fisted pummeling, the knife discussed here will have to do. Yes, the edge is over-polished. Admittedly we are taking a sow's ear to dinner.
Now, I'm sure there are many of you who shrug and point out, "Hey, a knife's a knife. Pick out a pretty one." And that's a valid criticism.
Perhaps "the knife guys" get too picky over details, and we should broaden the scope here.
First off, going all of the way back to Edo, there is nothing, nothing, like a polished V-grind edge, or more properly a "Hira-niku-sukunai." And if you've ever cut yourself with a razor, and never felt it, the circumstance needs no further explanation.
When you "take the curse" as JoeC and Buzz can verify, nothing is sharp enough, and we darn near bankrupt the house searching out new toys and sharpening tools on a fool's errand.
I don't like to "saw" through food. In fact, I once took a Japanese laminate knife to a Madison's Ginza of Tokyo for the chef performing "grilling in the round" for our meal. Knives should slice. The chef thought so, I almost didn't get my knife back...
However, not many of us carry a 2,200 dollar Hattori gyuto around in our jeans, or need to. We just need a nice knife. And that's the rub.
Many of the fine knives look out of place, and the ones that look mundane take a lousy edge. And truth be told, I don't want a high maintenance knife for this project. I want something to toss into the sink when I get home.
And until I can save a few nickels for a custom SShepard knife built to take a ham-fisted pummeling, the knife discussed here will have to do. Yes, the edge is over-polished. Admittedly we are taking a sow's ear to dinner.
S.Shepherd
New member
buy yourself a cheap pareing knife and sharpen the hell out of it. Usually bed bath and beyond has a ton of them.
The Tourist
Banned
LOL, I'm not ready to suffer that much! The knife discussed here is 53 bucks. And if it fails at this intended job it's good for other things. I'll risk that much.
BTW, I did slick up a 4-inch Chicago Cutlery clone one night for my wife, and the plate did, in fact, degrade the edge very quickly.
What I want it is a good, not great, knife that takes an easy to produce wicked edge with cheap stones, but has the edge retention of a guillotine and produced out of enough chromium for a Kenworth bumper at bargain prices although I has champagne tastes in cutlery.
In other words, a Playboy Bunny that eats cheese sandwiches on a date.
Other than that, I have no opinion, at all...
BTW, I did slick up a 4-inch Chicago Cutlery clone one night for my wife, and the plate did, in fact, degrade the edge very quickly.
What I want it is a good, not great, knife that takes an easy to produce wicked edge with cheap stones, but has the edge retention of a guillotine and produced out of enough chromium for a Kenworth bumper at bargain prices although I has champagne tastes in cutlery.
In other words, a Playboy Bunny that eats cheese sandwiches on a date.
Other than that, I have no opinion, at all...
gadzooks
Member
In fact, buy a ton of them. Then you won't have to take them home and wash them. Leave 'em for a tip...btw, TT, I got my Tojiro DP this morning. It's nicer than my Henckel's. I think I'm gonna like it. A lot. Thanks for your help over in the other thread..
Here's an option, a Japanese Suncraft with saya. Made in Seiki city. It's of kasumi construction and although only guessing because of the way it sharpens I think the hagane might be Uddeholm or Sandvik Swedish steel. The jigane is SUS-410. Don't let the price fool you as the blade is good. The handle is sort of cheap with a single pin but what would one expect at this price? I googled "Suncraft knives" and lo and behold I dug up a post I wrote about a year ago on a small and rather obscure cooking site. Here's what I said:
I chopped a few vegetables on the rubber board but put some real pressure on the edge while slicing and dicing conch on a poly/plastic board. This stuff is much harder on edges than people have been led to believe. Today I retested the knife's sharpness. The forward half of the knife had lost most of its ability to push cut and slice paper, my personal gauge for sharpness. Cheap steel would crumble and not come back to original sharpness when realigning the edge with a smooth steel. Quality steel will until it eventually becomes fatigued and needs to be reworked on the stones. I used a borosilicate (glass) smooth honing rod and, when retested, the blade had come back to life and push cut paper on all sections of the blade. It was as good as when I had finished sharpening it.
For the money, this knife is an absolute steal!
The blade is 3 3/4", very thin but not overly flexible. Just about right I'd say.
Did I mention.... about $10?
I chopped a few vegetables on the rubber board but put some real pressure on the edge while slicing and dicing conch on a poly/plastic board. This stuff is much harder on edges than people have been led to believe. Today I retested the knife's sharpness. The forward half of the knife had lost most of its ability to push cut and slice paper, my personal gauge for sharpness. Cheap steel would crumble and not come back to original sharpness when realigning the edge with a smooth steel. Quality steel will until it eventually becomes fatigued and needs to be reworked on the stones. I used a borosilicate (glass) smooth honing rod and, when retested, the blade had come back to life and push cut paper on all sections of the blade. It was as good as when I had finished sharpening it.
For the money, this knife is an absolute steal!
The blade is 3 3/4", very thin but not overly flexible. Just about right I'd say.
Did I mention.... about $10?