KitchenAid Pro600 grinds to a halt...AGAIN!

Not trying to say that I don't believe you, but it seems as though my KA KPFP850PM food processor is built like a tank because it was so well-made.

But how it is that one product, that was made in China, I might add, seems so well-made, yet a very simple stand mixer that once was the pride & joy of gourmet chefs and proud cooks alike has fallen by the wayside?! Note that not too long after Whirlpool took over the division, that a tidal wave of KA stand mixers were introduced in various sizes and model numbers. All aimed at wooing prospective customers into thinking that these mixers still have the same quality and reliability that was in place when Hobart had the division. Hobart only made 2 models, while Whirlpool went on a mad rush to fool customers and were pushing their mixers on the market faster than a bullet is fired from a gun!!

Their stand mixers, if you still want to call them that, are NO LONGER being made with the pride & care that used to be put in them when Hobart had the division, causing formerly proud customers like yourself to look elsewhere for a better machine of another brand over what they put on the market so hastily.

It is such a sad state of affairs when stuff is made so cheaply that it's lifespan is cut so short by a company cutting corners to save dough wherever they can and, like you said, the consumer gets ripped off because of cost-saving measures that make a once-solidly-made product become so frowned upon! All because the product that used to be highly depended on more than 20 years ago is now nothing but a piece of hyped up crap!!

It's soon to be water under the bridge. I received the replacement parts yesterday via FedEx, and I just need to pickup the H1 food grade grease from the local restaurant supply on Monday or Tuesday, depending on if they close for Presidents Day.

One of these days I'm going to get on a rant about all these paid holidays for public employees, while the rest of us who pay their salaries have to work. Another day...

ChowderMan said:

the pix don't show any unusual wear - looks like an el-super-cheapo casting with a light machined finish, no hardening, no temper.... the breakage looks more like something I'd expect out of pot metal.

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The new gear I received yesterday appears to be machined sintered bronze. This is matched against the only steel gear in the transmission, the worm gear. Steel vs sintered bronze, who do you think the loser is going to be? Not sure if you can see the color of the new gear, but looking at the non-machined surface you can tell its sintered metal.

looks like bronze - it would predictably wear faster than the steel worm, but the failed part didn't show much of any wear on the unaffected teeth - making me think the thing fractured down near the root.

This so-called 'changing of the guards", if you will, has been going on for many years with certain companies. That is, co's selling appliance divisions to other co's. It is nothing new.

But notice that when this happens, the product that once had integrity, respect and pride is no longer reliable, dependable, nor is the quality there any more.

Cases in point;

1. Frigidaire - a division that was once owned by General Motors who made the pulsating-type washers, was sold to what was known back then as White Consolidated industries, now is sold again, this time to Electrolux, was quite dependable & reliable when GM had the division. Most of their stuff, especially their washers now, are junk!

2.Tilia, a co that once made the FoodSaver brand food vacuum sealers, was sold several years ago to the Jarden Corporation. Before that happened, those machines were very reliable. Now they're nothing but a piece of junk!

3. Hobart, a co that makes commercial appliances for the food service industry, as we all know, once had the KA division. When it was sold to Whirlpool, the once trusted and highly reliable KA stand mixers took a vicious beating and a serious downfall, and are no longer what they were years back when Hobart made them. Luckily, I bought one of the last of the Hobart-made KA mixers, and it still is working very well to this very day!

4. Maytag - a brand name that was once so highly regarded as making the "Cadillac" of washers & dryers, is another co that has fallen by the wayside when they changed the inner workings in their washers. I once had a Maytag washer & dryer for nine years, and never had any trouble with either of them!

But in recent years before Whirlpool's bid to buy the co, there were numerous complaints from dissatisfied owners, saying that their washers were nothing but junk!
Maytag had hit rock bottom, and the co was about to become extinct until Whirlpool agreed to rescue the co from certain death.

So, as I said, this thing with co's selling their divisions to other co's has been going on for years, and you don't know what quality you're getting unless you do your homework and do some research online first. Otherwise you could end up with something that is nothing but a piece of junk.

Sherman said:

2.Tilia, a co that once made the FoodSaver brand food vacuum sealers, was sold several years ago to the Jarden Corporation. Before that happened, those machines were very reliable. Now they're nothing but a piece of junk!

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Sorry Sherm - Can't buy this one. I have a Jarden FoodSaver on my counter a few years now. No problems at all. Vertical unit takes little space. Does everything I ask of it. The issue with any vacuum sealer is liquid. If it gets in the pump the sealer is toast. I always put a folded piece of paper towel just behind the seal and have no issues.

So far as the rest of it - right on.

For some, it works.

A dear friend of mine who sadly died, it worked very well for him. Another friend just threw his out after the heater strip started malfunctioning. But he got 6 years worth of good use out of it.

Those machines just wouldn't work for me, which is why I went to another brand, just like JoeV just did when he became so sick to death of his KA Pro 600 constantly breaking down.

Mom used to say - Difference of opinion is what makes horse racing.

Truedat, truedat!

My mom always said; Shop around so that you don't end up being burnt.

In today's economy and the outlook on jobs that were once plentiful, but are now becoming and appearing to be so bleak, money is becoming so scarce.

The money invested in a product these days has to be a product from a very reliable manufacturer that has a very good reputation. Not some sleazy fly-by-night company.

Whirlpool needs to learn from this and correct the design flaws in their KA mixers once and for all, so that they'll return to the quality that they once had about 30 years ago when Hobart was making them.

This machine is the one that I was interested in getting years ago. it used to be demonstrated at the new England Home Show in Boston.

That gear you show is not riding in the center of the worm. The pattern is off to one side. Are you sure you did not forget a shim last time. Or they forgot a shim?

And, not all H1 greases are EP. Get some synthetic EP H1. Those teeth are wiped clean of grease and worn down.

waybomb said:

That gear you show is not riding in the center of the worm. The pattern is off to one side. Are you sure you did not forget a shim last time. Or they forgot a shim?

And, not all H1 greases are EP. Get some synthetic EP H1. Those teeth are wiped clean of grease and worn down.

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I wiped off the grease on the worn gear before taking the picture.

It's been repaired and is going on Craigslist tomorrow. This is the second time (original & replacement #1) the same gear has been wiped in the same manner, so it's not something I did. There are no shims in the transmission, so there are no shims to leave out, it's simply a poorly designed machine with inferior parts and good hype marketing. The forums prove this out time after time, and I think it will ultimately hurt or destroy the KitchenAid name.

Inferior quality, flimsy parts, dodgy workmanship and lack of quality control all leads to one thing; Crap!!

The KA stand mixers that we once knew 35 - 40 years ago is not the same today.

Adillo303 said:

Sorry Sherm - Can't buy this one. I have a Jarden FoodSaver on my counter a few years now. No problems at all. Vertical unit takes little space. Does everything I ask of it. The issue with any vacuum sealer is liquid. If it gets in the pump the sealer is toast. I always put a folded piece of paper towel just behind the seal and have no issues.

So far as the rest of it - right on.

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Also, another way to do it is to freeze the meat or other foods containing a lot of blood or liquid partially or solidly. Then, when you're ready to vacuum seal it in the bags, you will get no liquid being sucked out, therefore, no liquid gets sucked into the machine.

I do ALL my meats like that. After portioning them out for planned meals, I get them ready by putting them in the vacuum seal bags, fold the upper halves of the bags over and put a piece of Scotch tap on each of the bags to temporarily keep them closed and then I carefully place them upright in the freezer in one of the baskets.

A day or so later, they are solidly frozen. Then I vacuum seal them tightly closed, and no blood or other liquid escapes because it is frozen.

Big items like a turkey, ribs, a pork roast or shoulder, large beef roasts and chickens are usually in a vacuum sealed bag already, so I just leave them that way and just freeze them normally.

Was surfing the Web and came across this service manual for the vintage KA K-45 & K-5 stand mixers.

And from the looks of the gears, metal ones were used back then. Now they are mostly NYON gears today.


http://www.scribd.com/doc/176382158/Kitchen-Aid-K45-Service-Manual-For-Hobart-Made-Vintage-Mixers

ChowderMan said:

>>I believe this will eventually hurt KA

I doubt they even care. when things get too bad the current owner will sell off the name to yet-somebody-else-again who will have it made by an even cheaper Chinese company.

it's called a "cash cow" - name recognition + big price tag.

I have the lift bowl model - but an old one - apparently pre-gearbox issues.

hopefully not using the new spiral dough hook on the old machine?

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You were right, Chowderman, and HERE IT IS, straight from the horse's mouth!! I copied this from Wikipedia.org on their Kitchenaid page (link posted below) and pasted it here.


Today, some KitchenAid products are manufactured in Ohio, South Carolina, Mississippi, Indiana, Arkansas, Ontario, and Quebec while some products are manufactured in China,[12] and its appliances are distributed throughout North America.[13] All KitchenAid stand mixers are assembled in its factory in Greenville, Ohio. The die-cast parts of the machines come from various manufacturing plants around the world and are hand worked to remove imperfections on the metal cases. A factory tour, known as the "KitchenAid Experience," is conducted by the assembly line workers.[14]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KitchenAid

My KA food processor KPFP850PM was also made in China. Had it for 8 years. During its production, it was highly rated as being very solidly built & having what was then the most powerful motor in any home food processor! But it is a very heavy solidly made machine with a heavy die-cast metal base, and it hasn't given me any trouble at all. Never once has the machine's overload switch activated & stopped the motor though! One of the very few good products that I have the pleasure of owning though!

But KA stand mixers were always made in the USA, but of course, in THIS day & age, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if things have changed.

Adillo303 said:

Sorry Sherm - Can't buy this one. I have a Jarden FoodSaver on my counter a few years now. No problems at all. Vertical unit takes little space. Does everything I ask of it. The issue with any vacuum sealer is liquid. If it gets in the pump the sealer is toast. I always put a folded piece of paper towel just behind the seal and have no issues.

So far as the rest of it - right on.

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Hi, Adillo303.


Not too long ago, when my friend got his new Foodsaver, he showed me something that I never even knew!

It seems now that Jarden has responded to that complaint about blood & other liquids being sucked up into the machines' pumps during use.

They now include bags that already have a paper-towel-like material built into them, so that consumers who have had that problem can put that dreadful problem to bed.

Note that when you buy fresh meats at your local supermarkets, there's a piece of absorption material between layers of plastic at the bottom of the tray. Same purpose - to keep the blood from running all over the tray.

Shermie said:

You were right, Chowderman, and HERE IT IS, straight from the horse's mouth!! I copied this from Wikipedia.org on their Kitchenaid page (link posted below) and pasted it here.


Today, some KitchenAid products are manufactured in Ohio, South Carolina, Mississippi, Indiana, Arkansas, Ontario, and Quebec while some products are manufactured in China,[12] and its appliances are distributed throughout North America.[13] All KitchenAid stand mixers are assembled in its factory in Greenville, Ohio. The die-cast parts of the machines come from various manufacturing plants around the world and are hand worked to remove imperfections on the metal cases. A factory tour, known as the "KitchenAid Experience," is conducted by the assembly line workers.[14]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KitchenAid

My KA food processor KPFP850PM was also made in China. Had it for 8 years. During its production, it was highly rated as being very solidly built & having what was then the most powerful motor in any home food processor! But it is a very heavy solidly made machine with a heavy die-cast metal base, and it hasn't given me any trouble at all. Never once has the machine's overload switch activated & stopped the motor though! One of the very few good products that I have the pleasure of owning though!

But KA stand mixers were always made in the USA, but of course, in THIS day & age, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if things have changed.

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not sure what the question is / was . . .

the Federal gummymint has rules about labeling. if more than x% is made in X, that's how it has to labeled. you will frequently see labeling: "Assembled in xxx"

absolute none of that matters, to a degree. either the product is designed to be 'heavy duty' and stand up to 'real world use' or it's designed to be pretty junk - which breaks at the first opportunity. it really does not matter whether it is designed in Japan, China, India, Antarctica, or USA - virtually any designer can ensure the absolute minimum is specified and manufactured.

this is the KitchenAid mixer problem. started by Hobart - which specializes in building tanks, sold as "mixers" - brand name sold to xyz, thence sold to abc, etc etc etc. at every turn the "new guy" has to reduce costs to pay for the price of acquisition.

as I said before, it is the classic definition of a 'cash cow' - a product with high name recognition, high price tag. after two or three more brand name sales KitchenAid mixers will likely be made from paper mache and sold for double the current price.

if you want a good one - flea markets, estate sales, yard sales - buy the oldest, grungiest, dirtiest one you can find. clean it up, it'll last another 40-50 years. buy a brand new shiny one - it'll crash and self destroy in 2-3 weeks.

My 11-year-old grand nephew likes to cook & bake so much that he even has his very own little hand-held mixer!!

Though he probably has no knowlledge yet on stand mixers, I'm quite sure that he'll find out as he gets a little older and starts getting into heavier and better experience in cooking & baking.

When he's ready, I'll help him in judging which ones are the better ones to choose from. His mom also has a hand-held mixer that I got for her while their last year after her old one bit the dust.